Refinishing a new adventure

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DavidF

DavidF

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David
Wish me luck! I am in the middle of the most horrible and infuriating refinishing job. It's our own teak veneer dining table that has suffered over the years from salt scratches, jenga dents, water marks etc.. And to add to the misery there is a centre panel that has not seen the light of day for the last 10 years! other than that; easy!

I have stripped and bleached the top with Oxalic acid to remove some water stains. I have had a **** of a time staining the outer leaves; they do no react in any "normal" way to the stain colours I have put on. It is like working with something out of "harry Potter" "Davids every colour teak" I applied a nice golden orangy/Oak stain and in places the top turned a wonderful vermillian! I thought $%%&! so out came the bleach again and as soon as the bleach hit it turned bright yellow! The centre panel just to be contrary behaves beautifully and is now a lovely golden brown colour whilst the outside leaves are a blondish dirty yellowy sort of mess having been stained and bleached and stained and bleached a few times. I gave up with the staining and decided to go the toner route. I have put two coats of the ultima shellac sealer on to prevent any problems with compatibility with the next steps. I have read copious amounts on the web and am going with "tints all" and or "Transtints" to colour the Target EM8000 conversion varnish. People tell me to increase the air inlet pressure and decrease the material flow to provide a mist coat and gradually creep up on the colour I need. This table will be the death of me and what's more it is stopping work on the new bedside cabinets!!

More on Monday!!!
 
J

jeff...

David, try not to beat the wood up too bad with all those chemicals. One thing you might consider trying is wiping the surface with a little denatured alcohol prior to applying your stain. Or better yet consider not using a stain it at all, mix up a toner coat and apply between your finish coats.

Is your goal to change the color of the wood to make it look like something other than teak (stain) or are you trying to color match the finish (toner)? I think everyone knows how I personally feel about stain - it's some bad ju ju for me, I don't stain wood but am an avid fan of the use toner.

Just my 2 cents, hope it helped.
 
DavidF

DavidF

New User
David
jeff... said:
David, try not to beat the wood up too bad with all those chemicals. One thing you might consider trying is wiping the surface with a little denatured alcohol prior to applying your stain. Or better yet consider not using a stain it at all, mix up a toner coat and apply between your finish coats.

Is your goal to change the color of the wood to make it look like something other than teak (stain) or are you trying to color match the finish (toner)? I think everyone knows how I personally feel about stain - it's some bad ju ju for me, I don't stain wood but am an avid fan of the use toner.

Just my 2 cents, hope it helped.
Click to expand...

My goal was to remove the original stains in the table Jeff and in order to do that had to use a fairly long exposure to bleachs. This left the wood with very little "natural" colour, hence the stain to give some "life" to the wood. As I said, the outer leaves did not react as planned to the dye stains I tried first and and had some unacceptable results and had to remove that stain. This left me with the rather horrible result. So toner it is. I am thinking (according to my finishers colour wheel!) that a blend of burnt sienna and raw umber is my best bet added to the next coat of WB em8000
 
Travis Porter

Travis Porter

Travis
Corporate Member
Hmmmm... I have been a bit scared to spray VOC's inside the shop. Maybe for a small project (read non-production) it isn't an issue.

What are your thoughts on it?
 
DavidF

DavidF

New User
David
Travis Porter said:
Hmmmm... I have been a bit scared to spray VOC's inside the shop. Maybe for a small project (read non-production) it isn't an issue.

What are your thoughts on it?
Click to expand...

So far I've survived putting on 3 coats with 2 hr spacing! Plus all the toner coats, plus the 2 shellac coats. I have a good respirator and have my air filter going all the time. Seems ok. Overspary with HVLP is so minimal.
 
DavidF

DavidF

New User
David
I am having a few problems with the surface finish feeling rough. I think it is "dry spray" I think this may affect all middle age men, but in my case I may have my fluid control turned down too far as a result of being paranoid about lack of atomisation! I have posted a question on the Target coatings forum to get an idea of what is considered "too much" flow so that I don't lurch from one problem to another one; I will let you know the answer.
 
DavidF

DavidF

New User
David
My Question:

Hello,

I am new to Target coatings and to spraying in general, but have decided to start with Target coatings products after many rave reviews! I think I know the "why" to my problem, but not the fix. I am refinishing a dining table that needed stripping, and staining followed by toning. I covered the stain with two coats of the ultima shellac and that looked ok. I then applied many light coats of em8000 with "tints all" to get the colour I needed. I noticed then that all the coats were rough to the touch, but thought that could be the solids content with the tints; however, the last 3 top coats are the same. Now I think I have what is called "dry spray". Before starting I read much on the web about spraying and became paranoid about the spray not atomizing correctly so I think I have turned down the material flow too much. My gun is a "Vaper" with 1.4mm needle set. I have 25 psi at the gun and the fluid control turned out 1 1/2 turns, 2 turns was the same. Should the coat look "milky" or is that too much? Should I spray a test piece until "milky" and then back off 1/4 or 1/2 turn. I know how much is too little, but how much is too much?

Because of the tinting I don't really want to sand back too far on the current rough surface. Can I just lightly sand with 400 and then spray the heavier coat?

Answer 1

David,
Welcome to our forum pages.
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You ask a good question- how much is too much? I recommend that you follow your own advise and make a few test panels and get a feel for the wet film thickness capabilities of the EM8000cv and other WB's that you will be working with in the future. Generally speaking, I recommend and prefer to apply multiple, thin coats- between 1-3mils wet, vesus fewer thick, heavy coats that take too long to through cure. basically, if you start to see a heavy white/purple effect when you spray a WB finish it is a sign that youare applying too much finish. Back off by 50% then tweak back up.

Trial and error is the only way to adjust- but on sample boards only
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As for adjusting your current "rough" finish. Lightly sand back with 600-grit to remove any surface defect and shoot anotehr coat. Go thin...
JW

reply 1

Thanks Jeff, I'll try some test pieces tonight and see how far off I am. I'll let you know how it goes.

David
 
Travis Porter

Travis Porter

Travis
Corporate Member
I didn't think this stuff was water based, I thought it was a true lacquer with all the hazards that come with it.

With that in mind, I would agree, you are not getting enough material out, need to open the needle and let a little more out.

How do you think it compares to spraying the USL? I think we are on the same page the shellac is harder to do than the USL (at least it is for me).
 
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