Sherwin-Williams Sherwood pre-cat lacquer

Willemjm

Willem
Corporate Member
Anyone here use this product before?

I have a tight deadline project to finish in custom solid colors, can get this made up at my nearby store, so I ordered it.

Cross fingers, normally takes me a bit of time to dial in a new spray finish.
 

sawman101

Bruce Swanson
Corporate Member
I haven't, but I went to the Sherwin Williams store in Hickory 2 weeks ago to get some industrial paint for a tractor I'm restoring. Sign on the door said no admittance, call the number on the phone and they would serve me--no answer. I had to order my paint from the tractor parts people instead. What I wanted was the acrylic urethane stuff I normally used, in a custom color. So this Yanmar tractor will be the original boring green that makes you wonder why any manufacturer would want to degrade their product with a poopy pea soup paint covering.
 

Mark Johnson

Mark
Corporate Member
I used it for my kitchen cabinets. It was my first time spraying and it worked exactly like the SW guy said. So, I don't think you will have any problems at all.
 

golfdad

Co-director of Outreach
Dirk
Corporate Member
Willem I have a good friend that does furniture refinishing and that what they use most of the time
 

tijmt

Jared
User
I used it last year in my Earlex HV5500 to paint a dresser for my daughter and it worked great. I just thinned it until it passed the cup test and I was good to go.
 

Oka

Oka
Corporate Member
I have it works fine, slightly different than what I am used to, but then, I am not young ... except in my mind
 

Phil S

Board of Directors, President
Phil Soper
Staff member
Corporate Member
With a Devilbus Finishline 4, I would use a 1.3 tip with 23 psi at the gun and no more than 10% blush retarder
 

Woodmolds

Tony
User
Anyone here use this product before?

I have a tight deadline project to finish in custom solid colors, can get this made up at my nearby store, so I ordered it.

Cross fingers, normally takes me a bit of time to dial in a new spray finish.
If you're referring to T77, yes I probably spray 50-70 gallons a year, for the last 5-6 years. Not production amounts, but a good bit.
I personally love the product, it is high solids. Pretty forgiving of temp and humidity. I use a pressure pot so I can spray it unthinned, which is how it is intended to be used(per PDS). I use it as a sealer and top coat and can usually get an excellent job with three coats max. If thinned it usually takes an extra coat.
 

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Willemjm

Willem
Corporate Member
If you're referring to T77, yes I probably spray 50-70 gallons a year, for the last 5-6 years. Not production amounts, but a good bit.
I personally love the product, it is high solids. Pretty forgiving of temp and humidity. I use a pressure pot so I can spray it unthinned, which is how it is intended to be used(per PDS). I use it as a sealer and top coat and can usually get an excellent job with three coats max. If thinned it usually takes an extra coat.
Thanks!
Spraying these coats with a compressed air HVLP gun is a bit more challenging. The only advantage is small jobs needing a 5 minute gun cleanup, with disposable liners. Then there is so much air blow by, allowing blowing all the bugs and dust away when spraying without a finish room.

I normally get done with three coats, but for a comparable automotive quality finish have to thin up to 40%. Then there is the issue of evaporating the solvent without micro bubbles, meaning the addition of a retarder.

I have Lenmar’s (Benjamin Moore, Behlin family) conversion varnish dialed in 100%, takes less than one hour, three coats, sanding and drying times included. But no one close who can make up solid colors with this product.

I expect the Sherwin Williams product to behave much the same, hopefully. But with CV the solids content is much higher, over 40% and it does not yellow over time.

Doing a lot of custom jobs for the cabinet companies where the standard inventory items don’t fit. Over-loaded right now as everyone are closed. Problem is these are all small one off jobs and I have to buy finish by the gallon. So for the pre-cat Sherwin-Williams offered to keep the catalyst separate so I can mix for each job.
 
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Woodmolds

Tony
User
Thanks!
Spraying these coats with a compressed air HVLP gun is a bit more challenging. The only advantage is small jobs needing a 5 minute gun cleanup, with disposable liners. Then there is so much air blow by, allowing blowing all the bugs and dust away when spraying without a finish room.

I normally get done with three coats, but for a comparable automotive quality finish have to thin up to 40%. Then there is the issue of evaporating the solvent without micro bubbles, meaning the addition of a retarder.

I have Lenmar’s (Benjamin Moore, Behlin family) conversion varnish dialed in 100%, takes less than one hour, three coats, sanding and drying times included. But no one close who can make up solid colors with this product.

I expect the Sherwin Williams product to behave much the same, hopefully. But with CV the solids content is much higher, over 40% and it does not yellow over time.

Doing a lot of custom jobs for the cabinet companies where the standard inventory items don’t fit. Over-loaded right now as everyone are closed. Problem is these are all small one off jobs and I have to buy finish by the gallon. So for the pre-cat Sherwin-Williams offered to keep the catalyst separate so I can mix for each job.
If I were younger I would go with HVLP equipment, but I'm not buying new equipment now for no more than I do. I have multiple tanks I leave setup and only clean up my color tank and I use a cup for really small jobs. I have a finish room with filters, but it's still hard to keep clean. Sherwin Williams mixes all my colors, but I have to buy at least a gallon. I only use the T77 clear for top coats, color coats are primers. This is what SW suggested to do, I was skeptical at first, but it has worked out well. I have also always catalyzed my own lacquer.

I was doing all one shops finishing, more work than I wanted to do. He has two finishers doing what I was doing. I am semi-retired so doing less each year now and still doing some of his.
 

Willemjm

Willem
Corporate Member
If I were younger I would go with HVLP equipment, but I'm not buying new equipment now for no more than I do. I have multiple tanks I leave setup and only clean up my color tank and I use a cup for really small jobs. I have a finish room with filters, but it's still hard to keep clean. Sherwin Williams mixes all my colors, but I have to buy at least a gallon. I only use the T77 clear for top coats, color coats are primers. This is what SW suggested to do, I was skeptical at first, but it has worked out well. I have also always catalyzed my own lacquer.

I was doing all one shops finishing, more work than I wanted to do. He has two finishers doing what I was doing. I am semi-retired so doing less each year now and still doing some of his.
If I understand correctly you use the same product as a primer but colored? Or, do you use a vinyl sealer with solid color as the primer?
 

Woodmolds

Tony
User
If I understand correctly you use the same product as a primer but colored? Or, do you use a vinyl sealer with solid color as the primer?
Convoluted, but I use a white vinyl primer surfacer(P65W4) first coat. This does a good job filling and leveling and dries very fast and sands good. Second coat is Colored Vinyl Sealer(P63W2), Third is the T77 sanding between coats not needed. Light sand and top coat T77. Occasionally I use a third coat of clear.
How I arrived at this combo was by accident and would require more details. Because white can only be tinted so dark, I use the T77 tinted(for dark colors), base coat, second coat, & top coat clear.
It's not as complicated as it sounds. I've gotten lots of compliments on the quality of my finish, so I'm sticking with it.

My methods may sound strange and probably won't work for everybody, but after 40 some odd years of success you can see why I stick with them. I'm happy to answer any questions if curious.
 

Willemjm

Willem
Corporate Member
Convoluted, but I use a white vinyl primer surfacer(P65W4) first coat. This does a good job filling and leveling and dries very fast and sands good. Second coat is Colored Vinyl Sealer(P63W2), Third is the T77 sanding between coats not needed. Light sand and top coat T77. Occasionally I use a third coat of clear.
How I arrived at this combo was by accident and would require more details. Because white can only be tinted so dark, I use the T77 tinted(for dark colors), base coat, second coat, & top coat clear.
It's not as complicated as it sounds. I've gotten lots of compliments on the quality of my finish, so I'm sticking with it.

My methods may sound strange and probably won't work for everybody, but after 40 some odd years of success you can see why I stick with them. I'm happy to answer any questions if curious.
Thanks!
I have a white Lenmar Conversion Varnish undercoater, which fills really well and sands really well after about 20 minutes. If your P65W4 does the same I am sad I did not order it, because I have to spray Monday. I have a real dark color though, so it will be T77 all the way.
 

Woodmolds

Tony
User
Thanks!
I have a white Lenmar Conversion Varnish undercoater, which fills really well and sands really well after about 20 minutes. If your P65W4 does the same I am sad I did not order it, because I have to spray Monday. I have a real dark color though, so it will be T77 all the way.
The P65W4 sounds similar to what you're using. It fills really well, sands to a powder, and dries in about the same time. The catch is it only comes in 5 gallon containers(at least at my store), one of the reasons I don't use it for color. Most of my color jobs only need 2-3 gallons. Sometimes a gallon is more than I need.
 

Willemjm

Willem
Corporate Member
Sprayed the first coats of the SW Sherwood Pre Cat, this was my experience.

Sprays really nice, minimal grain raising and pretty forgiving. Lot less precision needed compared to my CV. But then comes the sanding. Compared to sanding CV it takes a whole lot more time and the paper clogs with little balls. This was after 2 hours drying. CV scuff sands in minutes, no clogging after 30 minutes drying.
Could be that my seal coat was too thick, hence the clogging.
 

Woodmolds

Tony
User
T77 as a sealer/primer is a little slower to powder up. Overnight drying works best for me with that product. That said, if you are running an exhaust fan you should gotten decent results after two hours unless humidity was extremely high. Sanding between coats works much better(faster).
 

Willemjm

Willem
Corporate Member
T77 as a sealer/primer is a little slower to powder up. Overnight drying works best for me with that product. That said, if you are running an exhaust fan you should gotten decent results after two hours unless humidity was extremely high. Sanding between coats works much better(faster).
Is there an improvement with sanding their vinyl seal coat? Thanks for all the help!
 

Woodmolds

Tony
User
In the clears somewhat, but it is more expensive than the T77 and it does not save any coats. So only a small savings in time. The P65W4 is the fastest drying and best sanding product I have used, granted I've not used all there products.
 

Willemjm

Willem
Corporate Member
If I do this again, I would use the P65W4. This job came out OK, but I have slight wood grain showing and some of the normal plywood grain defects. Not possible to hide that with T77.

image.jpg
 

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