How cold is too cold too glue up?

[Bryan S]

I know that you dont want to let glue freeze but is there such a thing as being too cold for glue to set up.

The warmer weather got me started on small project but now that its close to starting the glue up winter's going to show back up and I just heard that "S" word may even be in the forecast 8-O.

If you are wondering why I dont do the glue up tonight well the Redskins and Cowboys are on tv and for now at halftime my SKINS be winnin :eusa_danc :eusa_danc :eusa_danc

 

[JackLeg]

I generally follow the manufacturer's suggestions on the bottle or container.

 

[DaveO]

Here's a great synapses of the open times, minimum working temperature and other fun information for the family of Titebond glues. I think that you will find the specifications to be pretty similar to glues from other manufactures.

http://www.newwoodworker.com/reviews/titebond.html
Yes there are conditions to cold for Aliphatic Resin (TB1) or Polyvinyl Acetate(TB2/3) glues to set properly (around 40-50°)
Dave

 

[Bryan S]

Thanks for the link Dave. I didn't think to search Toms site. Of course if I'd read he back of the bottle like Reggie sugested.

 

[junquecol]

A real bummer of being a Redskins fan is every they play "Hail To The Redskins", the Dallas Cowboys get paid. Their organization owns the rights to "Hail To The Redskins."

 

[Dutchman]

I would suggest lengthening your setup time in colder weather.

 

[froglips]

Depending on the project, construction adhesive is a great goto in cold temps.

Jim

 

[SkintKnuckle]

OK guys, I thought I'd chime in here, since I have a wee bit of experience. All PVA adhesives (generally known as yellow, white, aliphatic, Elmers, Titebond, etc.) have what is referred to as a "chalk point". This is the temperature at which the adhesive actually turns to a dry white chalky film, and absolutely will NOT bond the surfaces. Each formulation has it's unique chalk point, and generally will be somewhere around 50F, give or take. Once the glueing surface has been impregnated with adhesive allowed to fall below the chalk point, the only recourse will be to sand and reglue at higher temperatures since the wood pores will be loaded with chalked glue.

Try this, take some scraps of wood, put it in your fridge overnight, spread some glue on it, clamp it and put back in the fridge, 24 hours later take them out and bust 'em apart, the bond will be very poor with no wood failure. Once you've seen PVA chalk, you'll always be able to recognize it.

Most literature will not recomend PVA for use below 55F.

Hope this helps.

 

[DaveO]

OK guys, I thought I'd chime in here, since I have a wee bit of experience.

You call 30 years a wee bit 8-O What happens between the "chalk point" and normal working temps? For example TB1 has a min. temp of 50° (the chalk point, I assume) what happens at 55°-60° does the cure time increase greatly??
Thanks for your info. It's great to pick the brains of someone in the industry.
Dave

 

[SkintKnuckle]

Cure time for PVA glues is going to be a function of ambient wood temperature, the moisture content of the wood, the species, and the solids content of the PVA formulation being used. These will be the most significant variables, although I'm sure someone will chime in with some additonal perameters. With regard to a glueline just a few degrees above the chalkpoint, simply increase the carry time several hours longer than you would normally use.

For thermosetting adhesives such as resorcinols, catalyzed UF (weldwood types), don't even think about going below 70 F. They may never properly cure at that temp.

If you MUST glue at colder temps, you might get by with epoxy, but keep in mind that the cure time is going to be double for each 10 degrees C you drop in temp. That's what I would probably go with.

Hope this helps.