"Floating Shelves"- method critique

[Henry W]

All
So we are planning to install 4 'floating' shelves in the corner of a room (no visible mounting brackets).
Each shelf will end in a corner of the room, and therefore will be contact with 2 walls: one end and the back will be on the wall.

This 2-walled installation takes care of the issue of supporting the projecting front section of each shelf. I have only done floating shelves once and those were the same idea - 2 walled installation that went well; no brackets or special hardware required.

These will be 8/4 poplar shelves that are 6-12" wide x by 20-48" long (or could also be described as 6-12" deep x 20-48" wide). I plan to route large grooves into the back and end of each shelf to house the 'cleats' that will be wall mounted (screws into studs). Once mounted on the cleats I will use a small finish nail or screw to retain the piece in place.

Given almost 2" thickness, what dimension would you choose for the cleat? I was thinking of a 1 or 1.25" square, with the cleat running to the within 1" of the end or edge of the board. At 1.25" this would leave 3/8" above and below the cleat. Or I could offset the groove to have more thickness above the cleat and only 1/4" below it. The material below the cleat only captures the cleat but does not really aid in supporting the shelf.

Cross section of the shelf.:

Given what I have described - what would you do?

If we can manage it, we will 'prevent' our adventurous/inquisitive/acrobatic cat from making this his playground, but one never knows with a feline. Ask me in year whether I have created the best challenge ever and a new playground for our cat, or whether these are decorative & functional shelves.

 

[HITCH-]

If this was my project I would definitely take advantage of the fact that these are in a corner and have a support on both walls. I would use a few screws from the bottom rather than nails. I would use a 1.25 cleat (preferably hardwood) centered in the shelf.

 

[Whitfield]

I've used these to good effect, and they should provide substantially more support: https://www.sheppardbrackets.com/

 

[Craptastic]

If I was going to do a cleat like that I would probably make it a french cleat so it transfers more of the load towards the wall instead of leaving most of it on the front of the cleat. And doing so I would use the larger size that was available so the 1" 1/4.

 

[Nicholsjr]

I’m making a set of floating shelves myself this week. This design looks much simpler than the dowel setup I’ve put myself through. I’m curious how much shear strength you’ll have with 1.25” in into the 6.5 in shelf. I agree with Hitch that a screw would be a much safer bet to secure to the clear.

I’ll share a photo of another possible option that another maker showed me he uses that doesn’t break the bank.

 

[DSWalker]

Would you consider using pocket holes on top of the shelves with a 3" screw and just mount them directly into the studs? With the width of your shelves you'd have at least 2 to 3 screws per shelf, and a lot less work.

I used this method on a bunch floating shelves that WERE made specifically for my cats. I have solid wood walls behind my drywall, so didnt have to 'find' studs.

So far they are holding strong.

 

[HITCH-]

Would you consider using pocket holes on top of the shelves with a 3" screw?

That's an interesting idea David

 

[Gotcha6]

You could probably get some 3/8" or 1/2" lag screws 6-8" long and drill them into the wall exactly level and saw off the heads, then drill a counter hole in the back of the 8/4. Take one side of the shelf into the corner and dado a spline into the front edge of it to within 3/4" of the front of the shelf and a mating spline in the end of the other shelf. Drill and bolt it the same way. Don't glue the spline to the second board and it can be removed later on. A set screw in the bottom of the shelf into the bolt will help make it secure.

 

[Wilsoncb]

I’m curious how you are anchoring the front of the shelf when corner mounted? Specifically, I assume the back cleat will screw into the wall studs. However, the front will most likely not have a stud 6-8” from the corner. That leaves you having to use a drywall anchor of some sort. I’ve never had good luck with any drywall anchors, so if you have I would love to hear your recommendations.

 

[tvrgeek]

The one time I did a floating shelf, I added blocking inside the wall and used 3/4 black pipe drilled in with a slight tilt.

 

[drw]

Over the years, I have made a number of floating shelves. Typically, they are similar to the technique suggested by Jordan (hollow with long supports attached to the wall cleat). One one occasion I did make six shelves out of 8/4 poplar which I attached to the wall via long pocket hole lag screws into the wall studs.

 

[Darl Bundren]

I might be tempted to just hang them on thin french cleats that intersected in the corner. Rout out a stopped rabbet deep enough to conceal the cleat material, saw the cleats, and screw them into the rabbet. French cleats on both sides would be strong enough to support plenty of housecats. And, you could work from the inside corner so you couldn't see the cleats from either end. Good luck with it!

 

[Henry W]

You could probably get some 3/8" or 1/2" lag screws 6-8" long and drill them into the wall exactly level and saw off the heads, then drill a counter hole in the back of the 8/4. Take one side of the shelf into the corner and dado a spline into the front edge of it to within 3/4" of the front of the shelf and a mating spline in the end of the other shelf. Drill and bolt it the same way. Don't glue the spline to the second board and it can be removed later on. A set screw in the bottom of the shelf into the bolt will help make it secure.

Dennis - I'm not sure I follow you here. EDIT - I have re-read and DO follow you. THanks

Just to be clear.
The 4 shelves are at 4 different heights, and each shelf is a straight individual piece. Yes L-shaped shelves would have been easier, but that is not my design here. No shelves 'meet in the corner' (i.e. nothing is L-shaped EDIT - there are not 2 shelves forming an L, only the end of the board forms an L END EDIT); no shelves wrap around the corner. The end of each board is in contact with the adjoining wall.

If I decide to change the design and move some shelves away from the corner, then absolutely some form of hardware (pins/rods/brackets) will be needed.

 

[HITCH-]

If the end of each board is in contact with the adjoining wall,(as you stated) then to me this would be an "L" shape.
The back of the shelf is vertical part of the L and the end of the shelf touching the adjacent wall is the short leg of the L.

 

[Henry W]

If the end of each board is in contact with the adjoining wall,(as you stated) then to me this would be an "L" shape.
The back of the shelf is vertical part of the L and the end of the shelf touching the adjacent wall is the short leg of the L. View attachment 227412

Yes, agreed entirely Hitch. That pic is precisely what I am expecting to do; the end of each board does contact the adjoining wall and the front edge of the shelf will be supported on that adjoining wall. I should have included a pic - as you did.

When I stated no L-shape - I was trying to communicate that "there is no additional piece of wood attached to a shelf to form an L shape on the adjoining wall." Agree that the end of each board forms an L shape

The essence of my question is whether my plan of inset cleats on 2 edges (the back and one end) would be enough support (without pins or other hardware).

 

[HMH]

Timely topic! Next on my “to-do list” is a large batch of floating shelves for my boys bedrooms, (~10ea = 20), to flank each of their beds w/ sets of 4, and then another 2 over their desks. Plus 6 in an upstairs media room, plus 3 in a laundry room above a sink, etc etc, etc. I need to build a lot, ha. Given the volume here, I’ve been scouring the internet to come up w/ the best compromise of strength and efficiency for this use, (~medium duty). If this was going in a kitchen/ pantry or other heavy item storage area, I’d certainly go w/ a hollow box shelf w/ an internal cleat, but for my application here, I think I’ll be going w/ an approach similar to nicholsjr above, and another source I found, and go w/ 8/4 solid white oak boards, 9-10” deep, w/ a ~1.1/4” rip off of the back to serve as the “integral” cleat, screwed into wall studs, and receiving 14mm dominio stock, (cut long to extend into the shelf pieces 2.3/4”, and secured w/ screws from underneath into the shelf portion). This should provide plenty of weigh capacity for lightly loaded shelves, (LEGO displays, and the other treasures that little kids tend to collect), that we want to get off of the floor/ window sills, and save me a ton of time vs building ~30, ~48-60” box shelves. Food for thought depending on your weight capacity needs!

 

[Henry W]

I think I’ll be going w/ an approach similar to nicholsjr above, and another source I found, and go w/ 8/4 solid white oak boards, 9-10” deep, w/ a ~1.1/4” rip off of the back to serve as the “integral” cleat, screwed into wall studs, and receiving 14mm dominio stock, (cut long to extend into the shelf pieces 2.3/4”, and secured w/ screws from underneath into the shelf ...

That is a great approach- that l may adopt too. Decisions, decisions.
Frees the design from the need to have contact with adjoining wall (the design in my case).

 

[Henry W]

I’m curious how you are anchoring the front of the shelf when corner mounted? Specifically, I assume the back cleat will screw into the wall studs. However, the front will most likely not have a stud 6-8” from the corner. That leaves you having to use a drywall anchor of some sort. I’ve never had good luck with any drywall anchors, so if you have I would love to hear your recommendations.

Agreed on needing to use a drywall anchor for most of these. I have had good experience with these, especially the type that have exterior threads to screw into the drywall. That was my plan.

 

[Willemjm]

Many ways of doing those, we use a Maple frame, with a sleeve which slides over the frame. The frame screws into the studs behind the drywall, using 2 1/2” cabinet screws.

Sometimes we do solid wood, build the slab, drill 3/4” holes into the long side of the slab, rip 2” off the long side drilled, glue 3/4” dowels into the offcut piece, screw it into the sluds, slide the slab onto the dowels and secure with screws underneath.

These below are solid Cherry mixed with Maple

 

[Dee2]

Is the other side of the wall accessible? Is the other side of the wall finished? If it is sheetrock pop some holes in it and screw in the floating shelf(yes) from the back. Patch some sheetrock.