Uggg... Drawers

[CrealBilly]

I'm looking for a good how-to resource on making solid wood (no plywood bottom) drawers. Seems there's 1001 different ways... I'm looking to cut through to the chase and find something that's proven and works.

Cough it up guys, I know your holding out on us


Thanks

 

[FredP]

ply wood, real wood, not much difference realy. I normally use plywood for the bottoms because its stable and I can build it into a groove on all 4 sides. for real wood bottoms you only use a groove on 3 sides. the back of the drawer is cut down and the drawer bottom is nailed or screwed in the back to allow for movement. if you are making undermount slides you can attach the bottom when you attach the slide. this way it is only nailed or screwed in the middle allowing for movement. I also make the slots for the front and sides a little deaper so the wood bottom has more room to move.

 

[CrealBilly]

I'm a little disappointed all I'm asking for in this tread is how you make your drawers and fit them into cases. Like I said there's 1001 different ways to do it. Open 10 cabinets pull out the drawers and see 10 different ways the drawers were made and hung in the cabinet.

Have you copyrighted your drawer construction? Are they Traded Marked? Patented? Confidential? Trade Secret? or ...?

This is a woodworking website, intended to discuss woodworking topics - Drawer construction and hanging is on topic and not against policy. It's a great opportunity to discuss and learn, so come on guys, cough it up...

Thanks

 

[DavidF]

Are we allowed to ask questions, such as "over hanging front" inset front" dovetails, dowels, Plain drawer with a fancy front glued on afterwards? Once you chose the technique that is within your skill base then I am sure we can give you a blow by blow account of how to make it. There's no point going to great detail about a beautifully dovetailed draw if you're a mitre saw and brads type of guy is there?:nah:

 

[nelsone]

I think Fred pretty much explained it. How you join the corners is up to you too, dovetailed, rabbeted, lock miter, etc.... The drawer face can either be attached or the actual front of the drawer.

I've done them several different ways.

 

[CrealBilly]

Are we allowed to ask questions, such as "over hanging front" inset front" dovetails, dowels, Plain drawer with a fancy front glued on afterwards? Once you chose the technique that is within your skill base then I am sure we can give you a blow by blow account of how to make it. There's no point going to great detail about a beautifully dovetailed draw if you're a mitre saw and brads type of guy is there?:nah:

Nope there isn't... but it's something to strive for. I'm a little bit above the mitre saw and brads but not up to fancy dovetails.

 

[Bas]

What will the drawers go into? Dresser? Desk? Shop cabinet? I haven't made many, but I found this video very helpful:
http://www.woodmagazine.com/woodvision/?bclid=1527680293&bctid=1213841038

 

[DavidF]

Nope there isn't... but it's something to strive for. I'm a little bit above the mitre saw and brads but not up to fancy dovetails.

A, ha, now we are getting somewhere then. Being you have a fondness for the dado, how about a simple rabbetted corner reinforced with small pins a la David Marks? Rabbet the corners of the front to the thickness of the sides, glue, then drill a couple holes and use some 1/8th brass rod to reinforce the corner.

Always start by making the back of the drawer a good fit in the opening. Next do the same with the front, leaving it a hair long so it needs a few shavings to go all the way in. Next size the sides to just slide in, tight at this stage. Cut the groove for the drawer bottom, I would use 1/4" ply. With the corner construction you can run the grooves straight through as long as the front one isn't deeper than the corner rabbet. Once the parts have been sized and the joinery cut, Rip the back to width. Removing a quarter inch from the top and make the overall width such that the the bottom of the back is level with the top of the bottom groove. This way the drawer can be assembled and the bottom sized and slid in at the end. Have the grain of the bottom running front to back if using real wood and don't fix it in place if it's nice and tight. Offer up the drawer to the case and gently plain to fit. Keep the reveal nice and even and "Bob's your uncle", as we would say.

Make the drawer shorter than the case front to back, this leaves room for the expansion of the sides and also give room for drawer stops at the back.

This is probably the most simple approach, they just get more complex from here, but for a night stand size cabinet with a web frame for the drawer to run on, this is the way to go.

 

[SteveHall]

Rabbets. I made a quick, super simple tray today with 1/2" plywood sides and a 1/4" plywood bottom. The sides are rabbeted together (1/4" square) and the bottom is let into the bottom with a 1/4" rabbet. It's a little finicky, you have to go slow at the router table when rabbeting such thin plywood or you get tearout. (My particular project was a 24" square tray, so I was trying to use the lightest materials I could to keep the weight down.)

For a step up (and to use solid wood), the material thicknesses above have to beef up a little bit. At least the bottom would need to be 1/2". By then, you might also want to use a little better corner and bottom detail than a simple rabbet--move up to grooves and dados. There's nothing wrong with solid wood sides and 1/4" plywood bottoms, the engineered material will greatly reduce issues of wood movement.

Last step up is to start fastening corners with more showy joints... box joints, dowels and dovetails. You can still use plywood bottoms to avoid movement issues, perhaps 3/8" or 1/2" for large drawers.

I'm curious--does anyone knows any good rules of thumb for the lightest material sizes reasonable for small, medium, and large drawers?

 

[FredP]

see? now ya know.... there is akchooly only 50 ways to.... er um oh nevermind.:rotflm: but I now know that mom wasn't lying. bob realy is my uncle!

 

[Travis Porter]

You get your boards and you hand cut your dovetails. The drawer when initially made should be just a little "snug". Then handplane the sides and top of the drawers down to a purrfect fit.

That would be the hardway.

I prefer inset drawers. I allow 3/32 gap all the way around. I try to make the drawers exactly the right size, erring on being a little to large versus too small. Dovetails are nice, and easy when you have a dovetail jig. I too prefer plywood bottoms, but even with plywood I do a groove on just 3 sides. Solid wood works, but you will need to do it like a raised panel to fit into your grooves.

 

[bob vaughan]

(edit) I too prefer plywood bottoms, but even with plywood I do a groove on just 3 sides. Solid wood works, but you will need to do it like a raised panel to fit into your grooves.

Years and years ago I did a couple of projects using solid lumber as drawer bottoms (A dresser and a side board). All drawer bottoms but one developed splits despite not gluing. One drawer did get glued in. That event was rather loud one night and took some searching to find the source of the rather dramatic "pop".

The raised panel deal is the best, and use a softer, stable wood works best.

I'm a fan of plywood and have never had a problem since I went that way.

I've got some butted, glued, and stapled plywood drawers for some ad hoc shop storage that I made 30 years ago. They're still holding up well to almost daily use, though the size is about 12 x 14 inches x about 4 inches deep. The joints look flat out awful. Enough glue and good wood to wood contact at the joints for maximum glue adhesion are the key.

No one was born knowing how to dovetail. The learning curve is about the same for router jig dovetails and the saw/chisel hand method. With routers, however, one doesn't have to have good chisels and more importantly, have to learn how to sharpen the chisels and dovetail saw.

 

[Travis Porter]

Personally, I can do "fair" handcut dovetails, and fair is giving me a bit of leeway. Sharpening the chisels has gotten easier, but sharpening a saw is something I am not yet equipped or ready to do.

Your experiences on solid bottoms is why I stick with plywood. As for sides, if I am dovetailing them with a jig and router, I haven't had much success with plywood as I get a LOT of tearout and blowouts. :confused_

I too have built a bunch of drawers with butt joints and staples, and they have held up well. I did use full extension ball bearing slides on them though.:wink_smil

 

[bob vaughan]

(edit) sharpening a saw is something I am not yet equipped or ready to do. (snip)

Mario Rodreguiz showed me a tip years ago. Sharpen the teeth in a rip configuration, not a crosscut. Look at how you're cutting a dovetail. Its mostly a rip cut with the grain, not a crosscut.

So get a cheapie back saw, a double extra slim triangular file, a cheap visor magnifier, a good light, and ear protectors (skreeeeeech!). TRY! So you screw it up. I screwed up several before I got passable looking results. It'll likely cut better than it did before when it had a crosscut set to the teeth.

 

[CrealBilly]

Here's WIP gun cabinet base, it's the first dry fit and it clamps together nice and tight but most importantly square. I removed the front clamps for the pic.

Anyways how would you make up the two bottom drawers? There are so many different ways, expecilly when it comes to hanging, I could make up a sliding dovetail center runner, I could use ball bearing slides, I could not use any slides at all, etc.. etc... etc...

Since it's a gun cabinet it'll likley have ammo in the drawers, boxes of bullets are heavy. I would like you make the drawers out of 1/2" ERC (sides and bottom) with a 3/4" RO drawer front or I could make the drawers completly out of RO. Help stirr me in the right drawer direction.

Has anyone used these drawer locks before? Are they any good, any pointers or tips?

Thanks

 

[bob vaughan]

Exposed lead doesn't like oak. I'm not so sure it likes cedar either. A good finish all around over the oak will help slow the process of lead corrosion. The white powdery corrosion isn't really a serious damage, it just looks awful. Ash, Poplar, Maple, or something other than oak will lessen the risk.

Every time I see an oak gun cabinet, I think of an early project of mine for holding ammunition. Had I put a finish on the inside and all around, the tannic acid evaporation wouldn't have done the damage it did. Three year old .22 ammunition looked 50. It shot fine and I cleaned things well enough, but it still was a point of annoyance.

 

[CrealBilly]

What will the drawers go into? Dresser? Desk? Shop cabinet? I haven't made many, but I found this video very helpful:
http://www.woodmagazine.com/woodvision/?bclid=1527680293&bctid=1213841038

Bas this is how I have been making drawers but I have been putting a 1/2" (1/4" rabbit) bottom in. Man that video makes it a lot easier, than me fiddling around at the table saw. I didn't know it was called a lock rabbit drawer wow I've been making lock rabbit drawers, who would have guessed.

My hats off to you Mr. Bas thank you very much :thumbs_up

Now if you can pull off a video on drawer slides you might acquire royal status. Although I doubt I can match anything the grizzly girls said about you :gar-La;

 

[Bas]

Now if you can pull off a video on drawer slides you might acquire royal status. Although I doubt I can match anything the grizzly girls said about you :gar-La;

Wot, like this? http://www.woodmagazine.com/woodvision/?bcpid=41945862001&bclid=1527680293&bctid=1213998904

It's actually not very difficult. The ball bearing slides have some left-right and up-down adjustments, so even if it's not perfect from the start you can fiddle with it to get it centered. The only thing that's really important is the width of the drawer. Try to get that as close as possible. Once again, you can fiddle with it if necessary. Too wide? Sand the sides of the drawer a bit. Too narrow? Put a few strips of masking tape underneath the slide, where it'll be hidden.

 

[Joe Scharle]

Jeff, using the partial pic of the snow shovel in the background, I guessing that your drawers will be 26 7/8 " wide.
Just a guess!

But I can tell they're wide enough for a center support if using plywood. Ex. in this pic,

the center support is also a runner. Your web frame doesn't have a center stile, so this method wouldn't give you maximum strength, but still is sound design. If I were building your ammo drawers, I'd use 3/8 maple ply. But you stated solid wood, so I'd plane maple or poplar to 1/2" and ship-lap the bottoms (face-to-face rabbets) with a reinforcing ledger just under the bottom, along the sides. Not only will they provide more support for the bottom, they give you more 'meat' for slide screws. Cut the drawer back to allow the bottom to slip under. A little glue on the front edge of the bottom and a screw up through a slot into the back. And Bob's your uncle!

Whichever way you go, you gotta finish the drawers with these.....Some fat...Some skinny!

 

[CrealBilly]

Joe that's pretty and all but it's me your talking to, remember... It's time to start the drawers. I pulled 40 BF of 1x8 ERC off the stack under the lean to and brought it in the shop.

The openings both measure 5 1/8" x 27 1/8" x 17 3/4" deep. I decided to whimp out and use ball bearing slides.

I'm going to use 3/4" thick ERC for the drawers (sides and bottom), do I need that center thing in the drawer?

Any advise here would be great...

Thanks