Oneida, Tempest, ClearVue ...

[Bas]

While I don't like the idea of the 6" duct work, it looks like I'll have to get over that because they are all apparently using that larger size. (I don't like the bulky size of it running all over the shop and the need for adapters for just about every tool)

This is probably one of the reasons Bill Pentz wasn't very popular with some people. Nobody likes cutting into their expensive [strike]toys[/strike] tools. And 6" duct work/ fittings are three to four times as expensive. Classic case of shooting the messenger.

 

[jeff...]

Don't forget that fine dust that's collected in the filter mixed with the right amount of oxygen makes a nice ignition medium for your after burner :icon_thum

 

[McRabbet]

<snip> I'm looking for a 230 vlt 12" or so blower now. I can't really utilize a clearvue in my location now but you can bet money If I build a new shop I'll have one.

David -- Have you looked at the newer CV1400 that allows installation in spaces under 8 feet? If you also review some of the owner installations in the ClearVue Photo Gallery, you'll find some creative ways that folks have fit their CV into shorter head spaces -- there's even one installed at an angle and it still performs very well.

I'm also adding a note for Jeremy and others contemplating a larger unit -- there is one important difference in the duty cycle with the larger cyclones that feature fairly big impellers and 3-5HP motors -- unlike the little guys, you don't turn them on and off every few minutes -- they are designed to run for longer periods or the motors can overheat due to the added load of spinning those massive impellers up to speed too frequently. So, if you plan to vent outside, you'll be exhausting your conditioned space for longer periods. I plan to incorporate a sound deadening return for my shop, as many others have done.

 

[Bas]

What options are there to keep the air clean and still have room to work

Festool

and money to buy wood?

Eh, work outside?

Blowing the dust outside might be an option if it can be contained somewhat.

That's actually a pretty good option. If I had a garage shop, I'd use a leaf blower or something to blow out the shop once a week or so. Normally, I run a small window fan in my basement, just to keep the air moving. I stopped doing that when it got cold, and I've noticed the fine dust really accumulates. Time to get that air cleaner....

 

[Will2]

Thanks Rob. I've looked at the blowers Ed has. I like them but they wont work for how i'm planning to install in my shop. Even If i do build an new shop I'd vent outside. In my oppinion I can't see spending the money to controll dust if you do not take the end product away form the area you are working in. I'm not worried about chip collection. I can sweep the floor easy enuff. I'm worried about my health. I dont trust the upgrade filters to contain everything. I'm in an area where there are several commercial woodworking shops and they all vent outside. I'm not at all worried about turning over my air. My shop is not at all air tight and if I need to open the door I can. Where I have changed my mind and going to a larger unit is to try and get more than dust. Most of what I'll be collecting will be from turning.

Mike can you add a shelter and sides to contain youd DC on the side of your small shop? You could use a 55 gal drum for chip collection and let your dust go out into the air.

 

[McRabbet]

David -- the key elements of the CV package are the high volume blower and the cyclone itself. Fine dust needs higher velocities to insure movement away from their source and the cyclone design removed all of those particulates very efficiently. The filters for a CV unit are really only needed in cases where the unit is in the shop -- if you discharge outside, there is less of a requirement for filtration.

At ClearVue, the CV Max they have is ina closet in the shop and the air is recirculated. According to Matt Morgano, they may remove only a few cups of fine dust from the filters after months of production routing of MDF in their shop. That's a good indicator of how efficient the cyclone is at removing the fine MDF dust from their CNC machine and saws.

 

[Travis Porter]

OK, so what if you don't have $1000+ and your space is very limited, like only 250 sq. ft. to begin with?

What options are there to keep the air clean and still have room to work and money to buy wood?

Blowing the dust outside might be an option if it can be contained somewhat.

I built (and still have) an air cleaner made from a 110V squirrel cage fan and 2 high efficiency filters on the input side and one on the output. I put a pull chain switch on it to turn it on and off. I find that it does very very well for cleaning the air. Total cost excluding filters - $6.

As for general chip and dust collection, finding a good used collector is probably the best route. I sold my old Jet DC-1200 which was in great shape for a $150, and I have seen many comparable ones cheaper than that.

 

[Jon]

Wow Jeremy did you get enough info here to decide?

 

[WoodWrangler]

Wow Jeremy did you get enough info here to decide?

:icon_thum

The order of this project will be to build the storage room off the back of the garage, and then move a cyclone into the space. I think I can vent outside ... my main uncertainty still is sucking the conditioned air out of the house or causing the pilot light on the water heater to start trouble. Then again, the garage is far from air tight ... so maybe not a problem?

I'm going to do my best to read through the Bill Pentz info ... again. I tried before but the web-layout of the data is a bit lame and difficult to read -- does he have anything in PDF that I can just print off?

 

[Travis Porter]

One thing you could do is have the cyclone outside but have the filter unit inside. That way most of the noise is out there and you don't lose any of your conditioned air.

 

[WoodWrangler]

One thing you could do is have the cyclone outside but have the filter unit inside. That way most of the noise is out there and you don't lose any of your conditioned air.

That is one of the ideas I'm considering ... but at the price of the filters and the fact I would have to have two holes in my house, I was hoping to avoid it :-D

 

[Jon]

Hot water is over rated

 

[Alan in Little Washington]

That is one of the ideas I'm considering ... but at the price of the filters and the fact I would have to have two holes in my house, I was hoping to avoid it :-D

Jeremy, do you have any windows nearby? Rather than cut a hole in the house I ran the duct though a shop window. I lifted the sash up, installed a 12" tall temporary foam-insulated ply panel in the opening. The panel had two holes cut in it- one for the duct running to the cyclone outside and one for the duct running from the cyclone to the filter in my shop.

On the other hand- you can discharge outside now, and sometime later, if you want, add filters.

 

[mburke911]

I am gald to see that everyone takes clean air seriously! Dust is extremely hazardous as Bill Pentz example shows. And let me confirm by personal experience that breathing is easy to take for granted until you have trouble doing it.

I didn't know until reading this thread that CV makes a mini cyclone for use with vacs. I think I might be getting rid of my trash can separator and getting one of those. Seems like a good compromise for a small shop. I could use my existing DC (with pleated filter) with a mini-cyclone separator. Does anyone have any experience with the smaller unit?

Mark

 

[McRabbet]

I am glad to see that everyone takes clean air seriously! Dust is extremely hazardous as Bill Pentz example shows.

Mark -- Here is a good Link to an article on Wood/Dust Toxicity (in our Link Library under Wood Reference)

I didn't know until reading this thread that CV makes a mini cyclone for use with vacs. I think I might be getting rid of my trash can separator and getting one of those. Seems like a good compromise for a small shop. I could use my existing DC (with pleated filter) with a mini-cyclone separator. Does anyone have any experience with the smaller unit?
Mark

I have a CV06 Mini Cyclone and it performs incredibly well. I have a 16 Gallon ShopVac (SV) and for a long time, I used expensive Drywall Filter Bags along with a HEPA filter in it whenever I sanded (RO or stationary 6x48 belt sanders) or ran my mitersaw connected to it. When I bought the CV06, I bolted it to the top of a 5-gallon Dry Wall Compound pail after cutting a 2 inch hole in the pail lid and adding a 1/2 inch wide foam gasket around the holes. Then I removed the filter bags from the SV and connected the CV06 in line with the tools -- 2-1/2" hose from SV inserts with no new adapter into top center of CV06 and second 2-1/2" hose fits straight into inlet chute and goes to the tool. I is very efficient -- I vacuumed up 2/3's of a bucket full of floor debris and did about an hours sanding with my 5" RO sander equipped with 120 - 220 grit paper and then opened the SV -- less than a teaspoon of dust! Check out the video on the ClearVue website if you don't believe me! (Sorry no pics, because I lost my PC hard drive a few days ago :crybaby2

Purple Thumb (Jerry Grant) has one too and has it riding nicely atop his Festool Vac.
I plan to make a platform above my SV to support it so the whole unit -- CV and SV -- can roll around the shop where needed. A great dust collection add-on, despite the price.