Flooring Nailer Re-visited

[Mad Dog]

Hi Folks,

This thread contains a lot of valuable information, from the experts here, for someone (like myself) who has never installed wood flooring:
http://www.ncwoodworker.net/forums/showthread.php?t=30616

Well, I've eventually pulled the trigger on an inexpensive nailer from Amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003AU15JM/ref=ox_ya_os_product

Also, I've more or less settled on the $2/sq ft bamboo from Lowes:
http://www.lowes.com/pd_142697-28573-602HN_0__?productId=3050915&Ntt=bamboo+hardwood+flooring

Looking at Lumber Liquidators, I came across some instructions that said the floor strips should be laid perpendicular to the floor joists. Makes sense. But what if the floor joists are covered with OSB. Do you still lay the strips perpendicular to the joists?

Not that I'm certain which way the joists go. This is an unfinished room over the garage. In the garage there is a (covered) steel I-beam that runs N-S. This must be the direction of the floor joists, right? Hey! I've been caught out too many times on assuming things!

To my mind (I'll have to ask the wife about this) running the strips W-E would look kinda funky. When you open the door, opposite is the far wall with a window (directly above the garage doors). Seems like the strips should run parallel to this wall that has the window.

Anyways, can I run the strips parallel with the joists over an OSB sub-floor.

Thanks for any comments!

Cheers!

 

[thsb]

I would think that the floor joists run perpendicular to the beam that you described, as they would either tie into the beam or run over the top of the beam with the beam providing support to the joists.

I am not a flooring guy but i think that you would be asking for trouble if you laid the floor parallel to the joists. there might be just enough play in the areas between the joists so that you would start having gaps and uneven joints between the boards.

i am feeling too confident about my answer so I assume I am missing something.

good luck with the project=i have always been a little too intimidated to take that on.

 

[junquecol]

Look at the OSB. Joists run perpendicular to long edge of sheets. Is OSB an approved substrate for your flooring?

 

[Mad Dog]

Many thanks for the replies.

Looks like I'm good to go on the orientation of the joints - the I-beam is N-S therefore joists are E-W. The OSB long side is N-S therefore joists are E-W.

Not to sure if OSB is approved for bamboo - hopefully it says something on the box.
Cheers!

 

[dpsnyder]

I'll be putting down the same bamboo flooring (from Lumber Liquidators though) at our new house in Burlington later this month. I bouth the nailer from them as well. Figured I could always sell it on craigs list and be ahead of renting it.

 

[Mad Dog]

Figured I could always sell it on craigs list and be ahead of renting it.

Yes, that's what I'm thinking. Are you planing on gluing or nailing? How come you picked LL - they charge a 20% re-stocking fee.

From USFloors:
http://www.builditnaturally.com/files/Bamboo_Solid_Installation.pdf

"... Nail Down Method: Flooring should be installed over a 15 lb Asphalt paper (roofing felt) or Red Rosin paper..."
Any opinions on which one?

As far as substrate, all is says is:
"...Underlayment-grade plywood and man-made board substrates must be clean, level, dry, and free of contaminants. Optimum results will be achieved through use of 3/4” CDX plywood substrate..."

Looks like I'm OK with the OSB.

Also, I'm sure I read somewhere that the tar/rosin paper can be used to fill in low areas. High areas should be sanded.

 

[dpsnyder]

for bamboo they recommended using staples. They said nails tended to split the tongues off sometimes. To be honest, I didn't look at Lowes and probably should have, you also get 5% off with the Lowes Card. LL had 3 levels of bamboo - new growth - cheapest, but had a lot of negative reviews on easily dinging, less hard than maple; older growth - more expensive, but about the same hardness as red oak, less dinging; stranded - most expensive, bamboo pulled into strands and then recompressed, about 40% harder than red oak, and comes in various colors. We liked the natural color and went with the middle of the road. Using their felt underlayment with a vapor barrier in it as well.

Hope all goes well.
Dan

 

[Mad Dog]

Dan, Thanks for the encouragement. I'll buy one box and see if I can do it.

Yes, I'm going with staples. Amazon has a good price - far better than Lowes:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0009XWLZU/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00

I like the natural color as well so I may have to order it through Lowes (free if you p/u from store) $1.99 sq ft. They have "Spice" in stock at my Lowes (Wake Forest) but it looks too dark to me - need to ask the wife first though

 

[Mad Dog]

OK, I'm ready to start on this but still a bit unclear on putting the first row down.

1. Apparently, the first row is hand nailed. I bought staples for the gun so any recommendations on a type of nail to buy. (Don't say I need to buy a box of flooring nails!)

2. I'm assuming this hand nailing is done through the tongue of the bamboo (as in all subsequent power nailing). What is to stop the far edge of the bamboo (nearest the wall) just flapping in the breeze? Is it subsequently held down by moulding? Or should I put some Liquid Nails down for this first row. (Trying to stay away from glue as the wife doesn't like the smell).

3. The far edge of the first row is about 1/2" from the wall (to accomodate wood movement, I presume). Fair enough.

What about the two side edges? Can I butt those up against existing paneling? I suppose I could leave a gap and cover it with cove moulding or something but it would look a lot better without the moulding (poor planning on my part when I finished the walls).

Appreciate any advice.

Cheers!

4. This floor is over the garage. Do I need to put down tar paper or rosin paper before the bamboo?

 

[sandfarm]

Definitely DO NOT run flooring parallel with the floor joists.
You can tell the direction by looking at the nails in the OSB, as someone has already mentioned.
Also, if this is considered a bonus room over the garage, and your rafters are manufactured trusses your floor joists are in line and part of the trusses. If not, and your rafters are stick framed, the joists are also in the same direction, but more than likely to one side of each rafter.
So, be sure to run flooring perpendicular to the joists.
If you can locate the joists and determine the width between them, nail your flooring down in each joist.
Yes, you should put felt (tar) paper over the OSB. A 15# felt paper will be sufficient. Don't forget to stagger the joints from one run to the next. Your joints do not have to end on a joist.
I nailed T&G flooring in my shop with felt over OSB. I located the joists and used a string to paint across the whole shop floor over each joist location with orange paint. I didn't have to look but a second to see where the joist was.
Don't give up on the job, because it will take a while to install and is a killer on your back.
I wish that I had known that you and others needed a nail gun, mine is new and collecting dust. Anybody need to use a floor nailer, you can get mine.
Good Luck.
Joe Isley

 

[NCPete]

If you want to change the orientation of your floor, you could use a 7/8" plywood over the OSB with the proper nailing schedule, though I prefer securing my subfloor with screws - much less likely to have a squeaky floor then.Every install I have done we used red rosin paper, though target paper will s)erve the same purpose. Good luck, and have fun!

 

[MarkE]

We put down bamboo flooring in the room above my shop. Got it on sale from LL for (I think) $1.69 sg/ft.
My BIL and I installed it. He has been a professional flooring installer for many years. The sub floor is 3/4" Advantech OSB. The flooring runs perpendicular to the floor joists, but only to run parallel with the long axis of the room.

We did not use any paper under the flooring, it is stapled directly to the sub floor. Staples every 6" to 8". The first and last rows (where we couldn't fit the nailer) are face nailed. We set the nails just below the surface and filled the holes with wood putty, can't even see the holes. The gap around all four sides of the room is covered with 3/4" quarter round bamboo.

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Had a couple of boxes of flooring left so I used it as a top for my storage benches.

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[merrill77]

Well, I've eventually pulled the trigger on an inexpensive nailer from Amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003AU15JM/ref=ox_ya_os_product

OMG, there really is a Binford Tool company? That's awesome!!!! Now I can get that Binford 3500 Board Stretcher I've heard so much about!
:rotflm:

(reference to the TV series Home Improvement)

 

[dave "dhi"]

Tar paper or rosin is only needed when floor being installed on first floor with a crawl space! Always run your flooring opposite to floor joist! Never install hardwoods over anything less then 3/4 tongue and groove sub flooring!!!! If you do have 3/4 and you staple, just staple every 8-10 inches(don't have to staple directly into floor joist if staples are used!!! Make sure you stretch out before you start or you may be hunch backed for a while! Have installed thousands of sqft of flooring! ENJOY!!:eusa_danc

 

[Mad Dog]

Wow!
Thanks for all the info and photos.

Dave,
Unless I'm going crazy, but something tells me that my 3/4" OSB subfloor is tongue and groove. I think I remember noticing that when the house was being built. That was 20 years ago so I may be dreaming.

Is that what you mean. Surely not 2 planked floors, one on top of the other?

Cheers!

 

[Mad Dog]

Nailed down the first box.
Rookie lessons learned:
1. Wear knee pads. My back is holding up but my knees are killing me.
2. A cut plank is now only good for an end piece.
3. Need to push the nailer with both hands, otherwise staple will be above the surface (requiring careful nail punch work).
4. Hold plank in miter saw with tongue against the fence, if the blade moves backwards to the fence on your saw.


Next project: building a grandfather clock from matchsticks

Cheers, and thanks again for all the advice!