Dovetails

[Jeff]

Terminology: What is the pin and what is the tail? I think that the pin is the narrower piece and there may be 3 of them for 2 tails. ???????????

Cut the larger tails and place the 2 boards at 90 degrees. Then mark the pins?

 

[Hmerkle]

Think of the tail board as a "doves tail" (looking from above)
In the picture below the top board

The "pin board" goes through the "holes" in the tail board...

 

[Jeff]

Thanks Hank. The pic is a good depiction of it.

I've heard of the pins first or tails first discussion but I don't know the reasons for preferring one over the other.

Cut the larger tails and place the 2 boards at 90 degrees. Then mark the pins?

 

[Mike Davis]

I cut the tails first because I can stack two boards together and cut at the same time thereby saving time.

 

[Jeff]

I cut the tails first because I can stack two boards together and cut at the same time thereby saving time.

You still need 2 more boards with the pins cut in them at the same time. Correct? It's the same difference whether one does pins or tails first.

 

[Mike Davis]

If you cut the pins first you can't gang cut them, and then the tails have to be cut one board at a time.

Only by cutting tails first can you save time cutting two boards at once.

 

[Rwe2156]

No, it is 3 cuts instead of 4. Plus you only have to mark 1 tail board.

Besides saving time, doubling up tail boards will give a more accurate cross cut because you've doubled the width of the board.

I have bulk cut tails on as many as 6 drawer sides at once. Tape them together to keep aligned.

Of course with 1/2 blinds you have to to tails first.

But sometimes I "run home to mama" and do pins first, which is the way I was taught 35 years ago.

 

[Dave Richards]

Tails first is generally more efficient as detail above. Ultimately it doesn't matter which you do first as long the pieces come together correctly when you are finished. Asking which should be done first is a good way to get folks wound up on some of the woodworking forums, though.

 

[Robert LaPlaca]

As full disclosure I am mostly a pins first guy 90% of the time..

As mentioned, cutting dovetail joints ‘tails first’ has the advantage of ganging the tail boards together, so both sides of the drawers or case sides are done together. Now the downside is the tail board has to be accurately jigged at a uniform height and depth in order to accurately mark the tails onto the pin board.

Cutting pins first, one loses the ability to be able to gang cut the tail boards as there will be variation in the pins cut. The pin board will be used to mark out the tail board on each side (right and left) the pin board is held perpendicular to the tail board along the marked baseline, I use a cabinet clamp.

Both methods work and battles can break out between which is the best method..

 

[Jeff]

Ok. you folks have done dovetails and I'll be a bonehead and numbskull.

Why can the pin boards be ganged and sawed at once like the tail boards? They almost look the same but I'm missing something important about the pin boards. Maybe I don't have the 2 boards oriented correctly relative to each other. If the tails are cut first is the pin board then oriented at 90 (the corner) and then the pins are marked and sawn individually to fit those tails?

 

[Robert LaPlaca]

Jeff, if you look at your ganged cut tail boards, notice that on each consecutively cut tailboard the width of the dovetail pins gets larger and larger (measure them for your self)..

So if the goal is to have the same size pins on ones project, gang cutting the pin boards (a la pins first) doesn’t really doesn’t accomplish the goal.

If one really doesn’t care about the increasing size of the pins, then I guess it does work (in the purest sense) since each tail board will be scribed from the pin board anyway...

Hope this helps

 

[Mike Davis]

These two boards match exactly. This makes one end of a box. The other end will be the same but maybe not exact,
the pin boards will not be interchangeable unless you are an exceptionally highly skilled layout and sawing expert.
It could be done but most people don't go to that extreme.
View attachment 187785

Then each pin board is scribed from a particular tail board and cut accordingly. Each is marked to keep the pairs together.
I usually mark the inside of each corner A-A, B-B, C-C, D-D so the pins that were transferred from the tails match together.
If everything is perfect perhaps the pins will fit the other tail board that was cut at the same time, probably not.
From casual observation they will appear to be the same, but probably won't fit a board from a different pair.
View attachment 187786

 

[Jeff]

Ok, thanks for the explanations and do's/dont's.

 

[Rwe2156]

If the tails are cut first is the pin board then oriented at 90 (the corner) and then the pins are marked and sawn individually to fit those tails?

You got it!! Always mark the outside face and make sure you've got it facing out.

With "pins first" stand the pin board up vertically on the tail board, aligning the inside edge of the pins with the scribe line then mark the tails. The only thing about this is you are cutting your tails from the inside of the board, so more care has to be taken about overshooting the line on the other side w(show side).

When doing tails first, its just the opposite, you clamp the pin board vertically in a vise, lay the tail board on top and mark the pins. (See Mike's photo above). With this method, since your marking the endgrain, you can saw the pins from the outside, thus avoiding oversawing the line.

Hope this makes sense..........

 

[Charlie Buchanan]

You don’t have a tailboard in the picture—it’s two pinboards with very different sized pins. Tails are sawed with kerf perpendicular to the face of the board.

 

[Jeff]

You don’t have a tailboard in the picture—it’s two pinboards with very different sized pins. Tails are sawed with kerf perpendicular to the face of the board.

I'm just trying to get 2 adjacent corners together so it's just 2 boards for now. I'm just starting to learn about dovetails.

The second board in the picture will be the pin board after I cut the 2 tails (XX) in the tail board. Thanks.