Cross grain gluing

[joec]

I am building two jewelry boxes (Norm's plans) for my nieces. The plan calls for a mirror mounted on the bottom of the lid (1/2" X 9" X 19") which is held in place by small narrow moldings with a rabbit cut to receive the mirror. These moldings are held in place by brass screws. I started on the first lid and glued in the bottom molding. Now I am starting to do the sides and wanted to glue those, but am fearful they will not hold if the expansion is a problem. Would gluing work in this case? One issue I have is putting a small screw in the available space, after taking in account the rabbit on the bottom. I have built two of these in the past, but screwed them in. I prefer the look provided by not having the screws. Thoughts?

 

[CrealBilly]

I am building two jewelry boxes (Norm's plans) for my nieces. The plan calls for a mirror mounted on the bottom of the lid (1/2" X 9" X 19") which is held in place by small narrow moldings with a rabbit cut to receive the mirror. These moldings are held in place by brass screws. I started on the first lid and glued in the bottom molding. Now I am starting to do the sides and wanted to glue those, but am fearful they will not hold if the expansion is a problem. Would gluing work in this case? One issue I have is putting a small screw in the available space, after taking in account the rabbit on the bottom. I have built two of these in the past, but screwed them in. I prefer the look provided by not having the screws. Thoughts?

Your right to question cross grain gluing for issues you noted. I would use screws with elongated holes in all four pieces of the trim and allow the mirror to float. With screws you could also replace the mirror easily if it gets broken.

I'm sure others have a better solution and hopefully will chime in.

 

[Gofor]

If you glue, just glue the center 2" or so. The expansion on that short a section will not be enough to overcome the glue flexibility. The other option would be a pin nail put in on an angle, which is thin enough to bend with the expansion. Third otion may be a flexible glue like rubber cement , but I have no idea how well that would hold up. Adhesive silicone might also work (being very careful not to contaminate any surface still needing any finish).

On future ones, you may want to make the moldings where the sides are trapped on the ends by the top and bottom.

Just some thoughts

Go

 

[CrealBilly]

If you glue, just glue the center 2" or so. The expansion on that short a section will not be enough to overcome the glue flexibility. The other option would be a pin nail put in on an angle, which is thin enough to bend with the expansion. Third otion may be a flexible glue like rubber cement , but I have no idea how well that would hold up. Adhesive silicone might also work (being very careful not to contaminate any surface still needing any finish).

On future ones, you may want to make the moldings where the sides are trapped on the ends by the top and bottom.

Just some thoughts

Go

I was also thinking about using silicone instead of glue. I'm just not sure how well that would hold the mirror place. I have very little experience using silicone as a wood glue substitute that's why I didn't mention it.

 

[Gofor]

Jeff,

I also haven't used silicone with wood projects like this, but have used it to caulk exterior construction items like around windows and trim on a shed exterior. It works fine on surfaces with latex and oil-based paints, so my thought was it may work on this project if the moldings, etc have already had a sealing finish applied.

I don't use it on furniture projects because of the problems any silicone contamination would cause for finishing (i.e fish-eyes and voids). However, if the purpose of the glue in this case is just to hold the side moldings in place (the top and bottom with wood glue actually holding the mirror secure), a thin layer of latex or paintable caulk may also work.

Just thinking out loud (or in print in this case)

Go

 

[CrealBilly]

Jeff,

I also haven't used silicone with wood projects like this, but have used it to caulk exterior construction items like around windows and trim on a shed exterior. It works fine on surfaces with latex and oil-based paints, so my thought was it may work on this project if the moldings, etc have already had a sealing finish applied.

I don't use it on furniture projects because of the problems any silicone contamination would cause for finishing (i.e fish-eyes and voids). However, if the purpose of the glue in this case is just to hold the side moldings in place (the top and bottom with wood glue actually holding the mirror secure), a thin layer of latex or paintable caulk may also work.

Just thinking out loud (or in print in this case)

Go

Or you might be able to finish all the pieces first then "glue" on the trim with silicone. I dont know, but might be worth trying... good suggestion Go.

 

[FlyingRon]

It took a few good woodworkers a few seasons to convince norm to stop gluing crossgrain together (he loved his breadboard edges).

 

[joec]

I have drilled the holes for the brass screws. Not going to fight it any longer.

 

[Jeff]

I have drilled the holes for the brass screws. Not going to fight it any longer.

I think you've made the right choice. Maybe you were overthinking it and fretting over some inconsequential details about glue vs screws. BTW, wood movement in those small/narrow strips making up the mirror "frame" should be just about undetectable so the mitered corners will be okay as is.

I think this Norm video shows what you're describing; late in the process at about 20 and 21.5 minutes and Norm has the dreaded glue bottle in hand.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYoG7X9_lCg

 

[wdwrkr]

I know you've moved forward on this, but thought it may be relevant to others, FWIW.
I recently needed to renew my supply of hot melt glue - which I use for everything but my furniture projects. While building an RAS dust collector and some 6" blast gates, I decided to use the new glue as I didn't want to wait overnight to see if my design worked.
Wow! First of all, very fast. Secondly, as a test, I glued two 2" x 5" pcs of plywood together edge-to-face. I ran a very thin single bead along the length - could not separate them within 2 mins. The glue is quite flexible, and yet makes very strong bonds. The potential problem with it is its viscosity at 380F - still pretty thick, so you have to be careful with application to avoid gaps. The glue is also perfectly clear.
The glue is Platte River General Purpose. I also have to mention that I bought a new glue gun too. My old one is vintage 1990s. The new one is fabulous. Heats up very very quickly, very easily dispenses the glue, and comes with a very good case (that's useless once you insert the first glue stick because the tail sticks out the back). It was a bit pricey, but the ease of application made it more than worth it for me. The gun is PAM HB220 ($80 on Amazon).