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  1. #1
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    Grain keeps rising after top coat

    White Oak. Quarter/rift sawn. Minwax oil based stain. Dry to touch, and white t-shirt wipe is clean. Applied 2 coats of shellac. Then was using General Finish Endurovar water based top coat. Very light sand between coats with 220.

    The grain keeps rising, mainly in the tight 'true' quartersawn areas using the GF product. I didn't notice it after the shellac, but after applying the water based top coat, it does it after every application. Can't figure out why.

    Thoughts?

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    Re: Grain keeps rising after top coat

    I have experienced that with dewaxed shellac top coated with enduro-var. As I recall, GF specifically says that enduro-car is not compatible with shellac.

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    Re: Grain keeps rising after top coat

    How are determining that its "grain raising"?

    Was your shellac 100% dewaxed (like Zinsser SealCoat)? or regular shellac which contains wax?

    Here's an oil based polyurethane over dewaxed or waxed shellac and bare wood.

    https://www.thewoodwhisperer.com/vid...-polyurethane/

    I don't know how it'd do with your water borne Enduro-Var.
    Last edited by Jeff; 02-04-2019 at 10:32 AM.

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    Re: Grain keeps rising after top coat

    What Redknife said above, I had a similar experience, and found this


    https://generalfinishes.com/wood-fin...based-urethane

    Ed
    Last edited by Ed D; 02-04-2019 at 11:14 AM.

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    Re: Grain keeps rising after top coat

    Quote Originally Posted by redknife View Post
    I have experienced that with dewaxed shellac top coated with enduro-var. As I recall, GF specifically says that enduro-car is not compatible with shellac.
    Odd thing is that this is my second project, using the exact method. First one didn't do this.

    Jeff: I'm just assuming it is the grain. Not really sure. I'm just using a rattle can of shellac that I had.

    It isn't horribly rough, but it is noticeable.

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    Re: Grain keeps rising after top coat

    The grain keeps rising, mainly in the tight 'true' quartersawn areas using the GF product. I didn't notice it after the shellac,
    So your boards have quarter sawn, rift sawn, and flat sawn areas?

    Any pics to show the problem areas better?

  7. #7
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    Re: Grain keeps rising after top coat

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff View Post
    So your boards have quarter sawn, rift sawn, and flat sawn areas?

    Any pics to show the problem areas better?
    Sure...

    Edited: Well, maybe not. Can't seem to upload.
    Last edited by DSWalker; 02-04-2019 at 02:51 PM.

  8. #8
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    Re: Grain keeps rising after top coat

    Try leaving out the shellac on a test board and apply the Vara-Thane directly to that wood surface after sanding.



    Quote Originally Posted by DSWalker View Post
    Odd thing is that this is my second project, using the exact method. First one didn't do this.

    Jeff: I'm just assuming it is the grain. Not really sure. I'm just using a rattle can of shellac that I had.

    It isn't horribly rough, but it is noticeable.

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  10. #9
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    Re: Grain keeps rising after top coat

    I think that the Gallery and Upload photos is now working again.

    Quote Originally Posted by DSWalker View Post
    Sure...

    Edited: Well, maybe not. Can't seem to upload.

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  12. #10
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    Re: Grain keeps rising after top coat

    With the oil-based stain, you should be using a specifically dewaxed shellac before a water-based topcoat. Was it dewaxed? If not, there are definitely compatibility issues.

    However, I'm wondering whether the problem is just with the application of the topcoats. I'd be surprised if the grain is actually raising through the shellac and topcoats, especially since the stain was oil-based in the first place. I'm guessing that what you're seeing is not grain raising but dust or unevenness following the 220 light sanding between topcoats. If nothing else, you might find that a microfiber cloth handles that better than a T-shirt.

    Or two other possibilities: (1) the shellac wasn't thoroughly dried/cured before other coats and the sanding/scuffing brought out semi-sticky shellac that acted like a dust layer, or (2) that there was dust in the air or area during/following topcoat applications.

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  14. #11
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    Re: Grain keeps rising after top coat

    I don't think the stain or shellac completely sealed the oak. Shellac is always thin and expecially spray on shellac. Stain doesn't really seal. So the water in the top coat is still getting to the wood in the area that is raising.

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