Klingspor's Woodworking Shop (Locations)

Special Events in the next 30 days

Page 2 of 5 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 63

Thread: Workshop wiring

  1. #16
    Senior User
    DQ
    redknife's Avatar
    Nickname
    Chris
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Lewisville, NC
    Posts
    673
    Visit Freq
    7.04 visits/week
    Threads
    66
    Classifieds
    0

    Re: Workshop wiring

    Quote Originally Posted by Brogan View Post
    I assumed that would be the case also, so asked for a few quotes.

    The price for 1 x 240V and 1 x 120V surface mounted was $425-$500 and that was without pulling a permit (which costs $75) and they said the price would go up because of it due to the extra time they would have to spend on site, etc.

    Which ironically makes the builder's quote cheaper.
    I haven't seen those kind of rates for electrical work. I have had a lot of electrical work done and done a lot myself with inspection. Good electricians can do that work in no time at all. The wire does cost more than you'd expect. Maybe look around a bit or get electrical contractor recs from NCWW members in your area. Most all of us have gone through a lot of electric upgrades. Make a thread "need electrician rec for Morrisville, NC".
    I wouldn't get too discouraged. It strikes me that the builder issue is creating undue pressure. You can take it or leave it and still be fine. I see one 240 in your immediate future and a couple 120's on separate circuits. You can structure for the final expected capacity (which honestly who knows) or piece-meal it as you acquire equipment. Have you thought of wiring your own? You seem the type that could work that out. There may be a local NCWW member that could give on site advice.
    To me, there are two main shop electrical scenarios that come up: new to the field and just acquiring some equipment. Building the electrical capacity for a finished shop doesn't make a lot of sense unless you are dead set that you are going to buy and use a lot of specific equipment. Second common scenario is moving the shop or rebuilding the shop. This is where it makes sense to place outlets every "x" feet, multiple 240's, extensive lighting, etc. That's just my opinion, of course, but I think you are veering in to the latter when you have no big equipment currently at all.
    All that said, a subpanel would be nice because you would start with flexibility. Of course you could let them finish and then add a subpanel.
    Lots of options here. Power tools need power. About everybody on the forum deals with these issues. Get informed then do what feels best for you and your current budget.

  2. #17
    Corporate Member
    DQ

    Nickname
    Daniel
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Clayton, NC
    Posts
    516
    Visit Freq
    6.38 visits/week
    Threads
    34
    Classifieds
    0

    Re: Workshop wiring

    Quote Originally Posted by Brogan View Post
    I assumed that would be the case also, so asked for a few quotes.

    The price for 1 x 240V and 1 x 120V surface mounted was $425-$500 and that was without pulling a permit (which costs $75) and they said the price would go up because of it due to the extra time they would have to spend on site, etc.

    Which ironically makes the builder's quote cheaper.
    Pull the permit yourself, then you don't have to pay the electrician to go to town hall to pull permit, etc. The permit's I've pulled let me specify the licensed contractor doing the work, just because you pull the permit doesn't mean you have to do it yourself.

    Remember when you sell your house, you have to disclose if you've done work like this and if you've had a permit. Without a permit you can potentially derail the sale. Had a recent sale the appraiser red flagged some work done without a permit, lender required a permit be pulled before they'd loan.

    Prices are up on everything due to shortage of qualified contractors, so they've upped their pricing, supply/demand, blah blah blah. End result is it's more expensive and harder to get contractors to do the work. I've got some small electrical jobs I need done that my normal contractor has basically said he's too busy with large jobs (new construction work) to do the small jobs anymore.

  3. #18
    Senior User
    DQ

    Nickname
    Dave
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Posts
    693
    Visit Freq
    6.27 visits/week
    Threads
    17
    Classifieds
    0

    Re: Workshop wiring

    Have the builder put in a 60amp sub panel and then do the rest later in exposed conduit. That way you can calmly plan what you need/want. With a little guidance, wiring isn't a big deal. Homeowners can typically pull their own permits and do their own wiring.

    A 100 amp sub panel might be better just from the standpoint it will hold more breakers. Cost will depend a lot on how far the sub is from the main disconnect panel.

    What you don't want to do is have all your shop lighting fed from the sub panel. If the main breaker to/in the sub ever trips your lights will also go out if fed from the sub.

  4. #19
    Senior User
    Nickname
    Jeff
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Rougemont, NC
    Posts
    5,277
    Visit Freq
    6.69 visits/week
    Threads
    520
    Classifieds
    0

    Re: Workshop wiring

    I thought I could get away with 2 x 120V 20A and 1 x 240V 40A (total cost $600) and use the 240V to run two tools simultaneously.
    Apparently that's not possible. I would need to have another dedicated 240V 20A/30A outlet, at a cost of another $300.
    That's penny-wise and pound-foolish!

    I'm an electrical dummy without deep pockets but I'd get a turnkey job done to my specifications from square one and stop agonizing. You're already spending a lot more than a few thousand to build your new home so another +/- $1k is relatively insignificant at the end of the day.

    I'm almost at the point where I'm just going to call it quits and contract out the jobs I want doing in the house rather than do them myself.
    You're call! What about all of those woodworking heirloom pieces that you'll be crafting to make it a home instead of a house?

  5. The following user says Thank You to Jeff for this useful post:


  6. #20
    Board of Directors
    President
    Corporate Member
    DQ
    KenOfCary's Avatar
    Nickname
    Ken
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Cary, NC
    Posts
    6,500
    Visit Freq
    6.92 visits/week
    Threads
    443
    Classifieds
    0

    Re: Workshop wiring

    One note the Grizzly 6-15 plug will fit into a 6-20 socket but not vice versa. If you have both 15 and 20 Amp equipment just install 20 Amp sockets and breakers so they can be used for both types of equipment. 30 Amp equipment usually requires a twist lock socket and plug - like you see on electric dryers.

    I'm not an electrician and this information is just based on my observations of what real electricians have installed in my shop, so take it for what it is. Non expert observations, not real advice.
    You can't make the same mistake twice. The second time it becomes a choice, rather than a mistake.

    "May the grain be with you" - Roy Underhill

  7. #21
    User
    Nickname
    Brogan
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Morrisville, NC
    Posts
    262
    Visit Freq
    7.00 visits/week
    Threads
    20
    Classifieds
    0

    Re: Workshop wiring

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveD View Post
    Have the builder put in a 60amp sub panel and then do the rest later in exposed conduit. That way you can calmly plan what you need/want. With a little guidance, wiring isn't a big deal. Homeowners can typically pull their own permits and do their own wiring.

    A 100 amp sub panel might be better just from the standpoint it will hold more breakers. Cost will depend a lot on how far the sub is from the main disconnect panel.

    What you don't want to do is have all your shop lighting fed from the sub panel. If the main breaker to/in the sub ever trips your lights will also go out if fed from the sub.
    As long as the builder doesn't quote something crazy for the 100A sub panel, this is the way I'm going to go.

    The image below shows where the main panel is (about 6 feet to the left of the arrow) in relation to the new panel, with the proposed 110V 20A and 220V 20A and 30A outlets.



    I'll run some PVC conduit (http://www.homedepot.com/p/1-in-x-10...7462/202295893) from the top of the 100A sub panel over the windows and down to the outlets.
    From what I've read, it is permissible to run 110 and 220 branch circuits in the same conduit, as long as the total number of wires doesn't exceed the limits in this table: http://www.constructionmonkey.com/ca...es/wireconduit

    I could use EMT but it's a lot harder to work with and I don't need the additional protection.

    The lighting, etc. are all on different circuits so no worries there.

    Thanks again to everyone for the input.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  8. #22
    Senior User
    DQ

    Nickname
    Dave
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Posts
    693
    Visit Freq
    6.27 visits/week
    Threads
    17
    Classifieds
    0

    Re: Workshop wiring

    There is nothing stopping you from plugging 2 or more 240 volt pieces of equipment into one breaker/receptacle.
    Just make up a short extension cord with multiple receptacles on one end and a plug on the other end. I built a welding cart that has 3 50a, 240v receptacles on it , with a 2' pigtail cord that plugs into a extension cord that then plugs into one 50a wall receptacle.

    One thing I absolutely hate doing is plugging/unplugging equipment/cords throughout the day. I also have multiple 20amp, 240 receptacles and 4 quad 120v outlets. Even some of my extension cords have quad boxes on them.

  9. #23
    Senior User
    DQ

    Nickname
    Steve
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Winston-Salem, NC
    Posts
    1,409
    Visit Freq
    6.73 visits/week
    Threads
    166
    Classifieds
    0

    Re: Workshop wiring

    not sure why subpanel needs to be so far away from main panel. Do you have your tools already? I have 3 220v tools and each has a different prong configuration.

    I'm jealous of your windows

  10. #24
    Senior User
    DQ

    Nickname
    Dave
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Posts
    693
    Visit Freq
    6.27 visits/week
    Threads
    17
    Classifieds
    0

    Re: Workshop wiring

    A lot of your expense is going to be the wire from your main panel to that sub panel. Move the sub panel all the way to the left and shorten the run. In my last shop I had the panel close to the entrance door so I could easily get to it.
    I also used mine as a total disconnect for the shop.

    If I had a sub panel in my garage where yours is pictured I probably couldn't find it today. You would be hard pressed to see the walls in my garage/shop.

    BTW, yes you can put multiple circuits in one conduit.

    One last thing. The sub panel, without breakers is pretty cheap. It's the breakers that cost the money. Go to Lowe's or HD to get an idea on prices. Your contractor will probably charge you double the cost you see.

    Realze that contractors probably charge $70-100 per hour and hate small jobs with a passion. Doesn't matter that they are probably paying the worker $20/hour. That's why I do my own plumbing, electrical, maintenance and carpentry. Over the years I have saved thousands of dollars that I was then able to put into tools for my hobbies.

  11. #25
    User
    Nickname
    Brogan
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Morrisville, NC
    Posts
    262
    Visit Freq
    7.00 visits/week
    Threads
    20
    Classifieds
    0

    Re: Workshop wiring

    I figured the sub panel would be better off placed close to the outlets, which are all going to be on that wall and where the equipment will be located.

    Otherwise it means running conduit all along the rear wall and then down to the outlets, and much longer runs for the branch circuits.

    If the builder does put the sub panel in I'm going to do the work myself, so the only expense will be materials (and the permit).

  12. #26
    User
    Nickname
    Brogan
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Morrisville, NC
    Posts
    262
    Visit Freq
    7.00 visits/week
    Threads
    20
    Classifieds
    0

    Re: Workshop wiring

    This is the same garage as mine but the opposite layout.



    It gives a better idea of the overall finish and where the main panel fits.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  13. #27
    Forum Leader Corporate Member
    DQ
    LB75's Avatar
    Nickname
    George (42)
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Concord, NC
    Posts
    392
    Visit Freq
    6.65 visits/week
    Threads
    49
    Classifieds
    3

    Re: Workshop wiring

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveD View Post
    A lot of your expense is going to be the wire from your main panel to that sub panel. Move the sub panel all the way to the left and shorten the run. In my last shop I had the panel close to the entrance door so I could easily get to it.
    I also used mine as a total disconnect for the shop.
    Exactly what Dave said. The distance from your main to that sub panel location you have marked is really going to drive up the cost due to the high price of the cable. Get the sub panel as close to the main as possible.

    The 12/2 Romex you'll need to run from your sub panel to the outlets is far cheaper than the feeder wire needed to connect the sub panel to the main panel.

  14. #28
    User
    Nickname
    Brogan
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Morrisville, NC
    Posts
    262
    Visit Freq
    7.00 visits/week
    Threads
    20
    Classifieds
    0

    Re: Workshop wiring

    If I do that then I don't really need the sub panel - there is more than enough spare capacity on the main panel.

    The only semi tricky part would be transitioning from a recessed panel to surface mounted conduit.

  15. #29
    Senior User
    DQ

    Nickname
    Dave
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Posts
    693
    Visit Freq
    6.27 visits/week
    Threads
    17
    Classifieds
    0

    Re: Workshop wiring

    Keep in mind that you can't run 'romex' in conduit. The only exception is if you are stubbing down from the ceiling for an exposed outlet. Then you can put that last 6 or so feet of the Romex in conduit to protect it.

    One way, of several ways, to transition into the recessed panel is with flexible conduit. Also keep in mind that you will probably be able to only come into the top/bottom of the recessed panel because there will be a 2x4 on each side of the panel.

    I'd still opt for the surface mounted sub panel. It will make adding your circuits a lot easier and you won't have to mess with a panel that already has a crap load of wiring in it. You also won't have to patch drywall every time you want to add a circuit.
    Last edited by DaveD; 04-12-2017 at 01:43 PM. Reason: spelling

  16. #30
    User
    Nickname
    Brogan
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Morrisville, NC
    Posts
    262
    Visit Freq
    7.00 visits/week
    Threads
    20
    Classifieds
    0

    Re: Workshop wiring

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveD View Post
    Keep in mind that you can't run 'romex' in conduit.
    Yes, I was planning to run single strand wire as per code.


    Quote Originally Posted by DaveD View Post
    One way, of several ways, to transition into the recessed panel is with flexible conduit. Also keep in mind that you will probably be able to only come into the top/bottom of the recessed panel because there will be a 2x4 on each side of the panel.
    That's exactly how it is - set between two studs - I was planning to come out of the top but I imagine I would still have to cut drywall (which is what I'm trying to avoid) in order to comply with code.


    Quote Originally Posted by DaveD View Post
    I'd still opt for the surface mounted sub panel. It will make adding your circuits a lot easier and you won't have to mess with a panel that already has a crap load of wiring in it. You also won't have to patch drywall every time you want to add a circuit.
    I think you're probably right.

Similar Threads

  1. Wiring help
    By Natelyon in forum Power Tools and Their Use
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 08-15-2015, 11:34 PM
  2. Workshop sound wiring
    By Phil S in forum Workshop Discussion
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: 12-28-2011, 09:31 PM
  3. Wiring a workshop
    By manfre in forum Workshop Discussion
    Replies: 25
    Last Post: 12-08-2010, 01:11 PM
  4. The mechanical side of wiring the workshop
    By Bas in forum Workshop Discussion
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 09-29-2009, 10:36 PM
  5. Workshop Wiring
    By rick7938 in forum Workshop Discussion
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 07-29-2007, 09:26 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •