fixing loose brick

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smallboat

smallboat
Corporate Member
At the bottom of my front steps there is a loose brick I need to fix.
To make matters worse it is the one supporting the post at the end of the hand rail.
Two questions-
What's the best material to use to fix it back in place?
Is there a way to do this without disassembling the railing to get at the brick?

I can imagine injecting some kind of adhesive beneath the brick, but if thats unrealistic I guess I'll have to take the post loose first then reassemble.

Thanks
 

Raymond

Raymond
Staff member
Corporate Member
Smallboat, can you post a photo of the problem? That would give us a better idea of the situation.
 

smallboat

smallboat
Corporate Member
Here's a photo.
IMG_18622.jpg

You can see where the mortar is loose on the right hand side. Same condition underneath and behind.
Hope that helps
Thanks
 

tri4sale

Daniel
Corporate Member
I had similar issue with mortar on my steps, picked up some mortar repair from Lowes and haven't had a problem since. I wiped out the loose chips and dirt and applied, and it's lasted about 4 years now.
 

smallboat

smallboat
Corporate Member
For better or worse the mortar is firmly adhered to the brick with the post but has separated.
Do I need to clean that all out or can I use the mortar patch to stick the existing mortar to the adjacent bricks?
There's not much flex in the railing to get underneath, but I may be able to work some in.
 

tri4sale

Daniel
Corporate Member
For better or worse the mortar is firmly adhered to the brick with the post but has separated.
Do I need to clean that all out or can I use the mortar patch to stick the existing mortar to the adjacent bricks?
There's not much flex in the railing to get underneath, but I may be able to work some in.

I just cleaned out the loose stuff, if it was stuck I did not chisel out the old, used some air to blow it clean. I'd work what you could underneath, and then on the sides, and see how it holds. Like I said, mine has held for 4 years, took about 10 minutes of work, versus the time trying to get that post off without doing more damage to the railings.
 

smallboat

smallboat
Corporate Member
I'll give that a try. If I can't get in there I'll just have to remove the post and work it from there.
I'd rather fix it now than have it collapse under someone when they need it.

Thanks again!
 

junquecol

Bruce
Senior User
The correct way to fix it is to first jack up roof of porch, so you can remove base from under column. After removing base, remove brick, and all the mortar. Power wash the areas where brick contacted other brick, let dry, and then lay brick back in place. Wait at least 24 hours before letting weight of porch back onto freshly laid brick.
 

Raymond

Raymond
Staff member
Corporate Member
I agree with Bruce (junquecol) on the correct repair method. I used the same method at my mother's house and it lasted long more than 20 years when she sold the house.
 

smallboat

smallboat
Corporate Member
Thanks- I'll see if I can get the base out from under, that should make it simpler.
Since this post is the end of the hand rail on the steps I shouldn't need a jack.
 

Jeff

New User
Jeff
Thanks- I'll see if I can get the base out from under, that should make it simpler.

The metal base is probably attached to the brick with lag screws...

https://www.todayshomeowner.com/video/how-to-attach-a-wood-post-to-concrete/

There's not much flex in the railing to get underneath, but I may be able to work some in.

Pics of the railing and what it's attached to at the other end from the newel post? The more complicated but better long term fix is to remove the railing, clean and reset the brick with mortar.
 

golfdad

Co-director of Outreach
Dirk
Corporate Member
Bruce is correct but it doesn't need power washing. Just brush the dust away. If the plate is attached to the brick....leave it attached.. jack up the post...clean debris and mortar out..put in fresh mortar and slowly lower post to righ height leaving the support in there overnite. Fill in the joints the following day.
 

Jeff

New User
Jeff
If the plate is attached to the brick....leave it attached.. jack up the post...clean debris and mortar out.

I like the idea but I'm confused about the logistics and maybe hard-headed too. Isn't the post also attached to the plate? How do you jack up the post to remove the brick and the plate if they're all attached to one another?

This looks a lot like the OP's post base and it's attached to the bottom of the post with screws from beneath.

http://www.vintagewoodworks.com/inalbbamopl.html
 
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Raymond

Raymond
Staff member
Corporate Member
That metal plate shown in the photo is more than likely attached to the bottom of the post and not to the brick. At least the ones I have worked on have been - they are designed that way to allow water and moisture to evaporate rather than be wicked up into the wooden post.
 

KenOfCary

Ken
Staff member
Corporate Member
Bruce is correct but it doesn't need power washing. Just brush the dust away. If the plate is attached to the brick....leave it attached.. jack up the post...clean debris and mortar out..put in fresh mortar and slowly lower post to righ height leaving the support in there overnite. Fill in the joints the following day.

I'd pay attention to what Dirk says as he does this sort of thing for a living.
 

smallboat

smallboat
Corporate Member
Thanks all!-

Took a closer look this morning and there appears to be something like a hanger bolt that goes into the post above the plate and into the brick below.
There is only enough flex in the railing to wiggle the brick side to side <1/4" and maybe 1/8" up and down at most.

Starting to look like I'll need to knock the post loose from the end of the railing, and treat it as one assembly- brick+plate+post.
clean out the grout and reset.
then reattach the post to the railing.

More than I was hoping for, but doable.
 

Mike Davis

Mike
Corporate Member
Because the post, plate, and brick are acting as one unit any stress/movement applied to the rail (i.e. every time some body grabs the rail) will loosen the brick again.

You may want to see if there is a way to re-enforce that joint/connection with a longer rebar, lag, pin, or other device to strengthen the joint rather than just mortar.
 

smallboat

smallboat
Corporate Member
Mike-
I imagine that's what caused the current condition.

If anyone has suggestions on how to more firmly attach that brick in place please chime in!
If mortar is the answer I'll go that way, if there's something better for a special case like this I'd like to know about it.
 

FredP

Fred
Corporate Member
Here's a photo.
IMG_18622.jpg

You can see where the mortar is loose on the right hand side. Same condition underneath and behind.
Hope that helps
Thanks

this is a poor way to build the rails to begin with. I would tear out the rails and the post, then I would remove the paver at the bottom of the stairs, dig a hole and set a new post in concrete, then fix the brick and build new rails. as what has been said already, the mortar would break loose again with any side pressure.
 
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