Classes and Cost: what's fair?

[nn4jw]

Teaching / learning woodworking is an interesting dynamic. Traditionally the wide range of skills needed to be a well rounded woodworker, say journey or master level, has historically involved apprentising, at least before the majority of furniture building was industrialized. At the very least it has been on the job training. There are many people today offering topic specific short courses, typically less than 2 weeks down to half days mostly targeting the hobbiest. Many, if not most, hobbiest woodworkers are self taught with the occasional short course to fill in specific interests.

Some specialized businesses such as building organs still rely on apprentising. It's not like there are enough businesses doing that to support a dedicated school to train workers. That's also not really something you do for a hobby either.

I'd think that trying to actually earn a living teaching hobbiests almost anything is a tough row to hoe these days. Too much competition from free sources online lowers the perceived value. Those people with actual talent and aptitude for woodworking always seem to find a way to acquire the skills. (How did you acquire yours?) Those without the talent and aptitude probably cannot be taught anything significant and will blame the teacher for their failure to immediately master a given topic.

If I come across as cynical on this topic it's because having taught many computer technical short courses and seminars over a 40 year career I learned the sad truth, "Don't try to teach a pig how to sing. It can't be done and it annoys the pig." You learn to treasure the occasional student who "gets it".

 

[RayH]

I think this site was created for woodworkers to share ideas and knowledge. charging for that knowledge seems contrary to this. paying for materials , tools ect. is one thing but charging fellow members for instruction and such kinda goes against our non profit status IMHO. Maybe our founder will step in and set us strait? Steve? :icon_scra

I agree with Fred. I think this thread has overrun its course on NCWOODWORKER.NET and suggest the admins close it. Commercial stuff belongs elsewhere.

 

[Jeremy Scuteri]

I agree with Fred. I think this thread has overrun its course on NCWOODWORKER.NET and suggest the admins close it. Commercial stuff belongs elsewhere.

This discussion has been civil and is very relevant to NCWW, I see no reason to close the thread. The fact that offered courses seem to fill up quickly with or without fees indicates that the membership as a whole is okay with paying a fee for instruction. The fact that people have been requesting more workshops even though the most recent workshops have had a fee is further proof of this.

Make no mistake about it, If we mandate that all workshops must be free, that will be a barrier for offering classes and there will be less of them in the future. If any individual wants to see more free workshops, you are more than welcome to "be the change you want to see in the world", just offer a free workshop, nobody will stop you and many will be appreciative.

If you want to offer a workshop for a fee, go ahead and do that. They are popular and the membership wants more of them. If people don't want to pay the fee, they won't sign up. Very simple.

 

[Raymond]

As a novice/budding woodworker, I take advantage of the classes the interest me and that I can squeeze in without conflict to my work schedule. Some have been free, some have been a donation to this great web site, and some have been for a larger fee. I appreciate all of them, even if I can't get to them because I know they are out there and will be offered again sometime in the future. If I am willing to pay for the training/immersion into something that may be of interest to me, I welcome the input on this web site.

 

[Graywolf]

I have taught a few workshops over the past couple years and plan on doing a few this year. I have also had a few one on one teaching moments over many years. For the most part the teaching I have done with NCWW have been on a donation bases for the web site. Personally I have done this as much for myself as anyone else, and I'm not afraid to say that it's been training myself to be a better presenter. With every workshop I have done I have come away with ideas for improving the workshop and make it a better experience for the students, therefore making me a better instructor. At lest that's the theory anyway. I have been a woodworker all my life, as a hobbyist and as a professional, as such I have a lot of knowledge to share. This in no way is to imply I know everything, because there are certain things that I've never really cared for or I haven't put on a high priority, so you my find me showing up to a chair making workshop as a student and not a segmented turning workshop. It's not that don't find that stuff cool, it's just not for me. However, the point is if your wanting to offer a workshop and you feel your time has value then by all means charge accordingly, because in the long run I'm going to reach a point where certain workshops I will have to charge for my time as well. I truly hope everyone understands that as a none profit organization doesn't mean that instructors should not be compensated for their time. And as the skill levels increase then that's going to be the natural evolution of sharing and instruction.